Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby twomasters » Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:03 pm

I do this drill a lot with one of the pros I teach— where we put a cone out between his feet and the ball and have him rehearse that the hands look out past (ball side) the cone from his perspective... as a drill. They never really get out that far when hitting but it has helped him get his rear armin front of his body on the way to the hitting area into more of a pitch elbow perspective.. rather than have it trapped behind him where he has to punch it out from behind and roll the club around
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His release has become much better as a result and his ball flight has become much straighter and less prone to blocks and hooks
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby lagpressure » Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:36 pm

I like to teach good spine tilt with a full shoulder rotation with healthy weight transfer over the right leg. The Snead diagram that shows the
shoulders rotated (caddy view) to 1 o clock but the arm travel is much shorter to 10 o clock. This leaves a good size gap that is then closed later into the downswing.
I never want to see the left arm above the shoulder line from a DTL view. It can be above at the apex of the backswing
but must work down quickly if one wants to be able to leverage the torso rotation.

The spine tilt assures a players arms never get stuck behind them. It leaves a lot of space for the arms to travel freely down the 4:30 line. Weight transfer
pressured off the right foot and leg help delay the premature early unwinding of the torso and shoulders. If done in sequence, the entire downswing can feel
strong and aggressive. No waiting or having to feel slow.

Sequencing is the key.
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby k2baloo » Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:46 pm

Brad,
I appreciate you taking the time to post your photos and thoughts. Looks like you have some good players there.
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby stevemcgee99 » Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:55 pm

Just remembered, Brad. The video where you have the Hogan photo showing how far out the left arm is from the armpit also has a section where you talk about people being told to squeeze towels under their armpits and how this is wrong if done throughout the whole swing. It's probably at least a 2 year old video.
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby lagpressure » Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:48 pm

stevemcgee99 wrote:Just remembered, Brad. The video where you have the Hogan photo showing how far out the left arm is from the armpit also has a section where you talk about people being told to squeeze towels under their armpits and how this is wrong if done throughout the whole swing. It's probably at least a 2 year old video.


P3 to P4, towel drill is fine.
Not so good for the whole swing.
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby nfbandon » Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:23 pm

John wrote:

"As far as a way to slot the club? Yes, this is garbage.

Here is the teacher's move just after transition.
To the right is the cronic OTT hacker swing I posted.. who hasn't been fixed or worked on.
The teacher has his hand path just about the same as the hacker? Over the top of the right shoulder? Garbage!

If the soft hands get him to lay the shaft back some, it would help the hacker some. I get that.

Maybe there is another video of what he teaches that he shows himself or one of his better players that goes from a good position at the top,
then flattens it into the slot?



What am I missing?"

What you are missing is a teacher that makes his students better, whether they be 60 year old women, teenage boys or tour players.

There are many "slotting" videos for GG. This is one. As you can see he can get pretty slotted. Perhaps too much so.



GG can swing many different ways, and he doesn't try and get each student to do the same thing. He does look like the student in that video, which is probably intentional. He is making the student better within his natural swing shape. When he works with Johnny, his swing takes on Johnny's shape.

I didn't know this thread was about "slotting." I was not a natural slotter. I slotted once. See the video at around 1.04 of the video below. It isn't just getting the club there. It is getting it there so that a violent reaction occurs. It occurred for me on that one swing. As I tried to bring the club to bend left post impact with left side crunch it was later in the video it was lost.



For me, the pursuit became a needless obsession. What I have found is all you need is a tiny bit. I have that. ABS cured me of the flip I brought into it. For that I am grateful. I never hook the ball, and now I don't hit the weak right shot, which was my ABS miss when I wasn't feeling strong.

I am also not as young as I used to be with brutal pain in my lower back. I manage it with a tailored workout regime, but there is no beating father time and my swing reflects that.

So this is the swing I have today (for some reason it wouldn't load so you will have to click the link) and, while there is always something to work on, I am okay with it.

https://www.youtube.com/edit?o=U&video_id=9u42MarcXKM

I enjoy the discussion, but not when what I contribute is called garbage.
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby k2baloo » Wed Feb 14, 2018 3:15 pm

When I think of this topic, hands out in front, I am thinking of what Roberto De Vicenzo is doing here. Very shallow shaft angle with hands away from the body. Seems like it gives you great leverage to rip the club left post impact.

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Grady - I'm guessing this is the one you were going to post

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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby nfbandon » Wed Feb 14, 2018 6:16 pm

Yes, thank you.
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby lagpressure » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:14 pm

I still am not sure what "hands out in front" means specifically as far as this topic.
I've only seen a video of the teacher hoisting his hands way up, then pushing his hands out toward the ball and having the shaft still very steep, (not as steep) with him praising the technique
and his pupil for doing it perfectly while referring to slotting, flattening the shaft etc. So, yes, that is a garbage move. Other than that, I have no idea what else he is teaching for other aspects of
the game or swing.

Steve who started this thread, not really about transition,was out here for a lesson today on his way to Mike's to pick up his new persimmons. We worked on getting him shallowed out using transition and lower body leg action, not trying to do anything with the arms or hands.

Before adjustments
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After (and the blue skies came out!)
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Re: Insight - Keeping hands out in front (?)

Postby lagpressure » Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:51 pm

nfbandon wrote:John wrote:

I enjoy the discussion, but not when what I contribute is called garbage.


Grady, with all due respect...let me clear this up.
These videos are not YOU teaching, they are his....his theories etc.
You are contributing by posting them here for discussion, which is great. I have said and will say it again.
He needs to be listening to you, learning from your beautiful golf swing.

I'm only commenting because his stuff is being posted here.
I'm sure he would not like what I have to say if I showed up on his driving range with set of heavy persimmons and talking about slotting the club through
opposing forces created by clockwise forearm rotation pinned against lateral lower body action.

I get he is trying to make people better. So am I.
His method might be quick, mine might take 2 years. But I prefer to focus on doing things with the highest ideals in mind tailored for very dedicated students who are willing
to work hard and endure the hardships and frustrations on the way. It's not for everyone... but it's been almost 10 years now and the success stories keep coming in.

From what I have seen posted here (only what I have seen here).... in my opinion, his method is garbage.

1. Hoist the club up, throw the hands forward to put the shaft back on plane, come down steep.
2. Open the hips and shoulders quickly from the top while squating will leave nothing left post impact to keep pressure on the shaft.

So far, from what I have seen... he is promoting velocity over acceleration, his choice (fair enough)... but not mine.
However, in this golf world of obsessive distance fanatics, from the tour down to the neighborhood driving range, he might be very popular.

Persimmon is out of fashion as are long irons, tight fairways, small greens, high spinning rubber balata golf balls, steel spikes, razor thin blade irons, caddies and courses that require
a much deeper complexity of shotmaking. My opinion ... however unpopular, I feel like golf as a game is regressing backward, becoming much less interesting, much less thought provoking, totally out of proportion from tee to green and lacking regulation, direction and stewardship.... among other things.

I'm actually surprised this site is still online or that anyone could even care about anything older than a Callaway hybrid.

Don't take anything personally Grady because this is not about you at all.. it's about the guy in the video and what he is saying., you would not want me to say anything that I didn't believe to be truthful and from the core of what I believe. If I thought his stuff was great I would praise it. I like Mike Maves, and Waldron. I like a lot of what Mac O says or even Ballard.
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